*shrugs* Cast your eyes up to the top there; note that the words "I'm natural multiple, not trauma-induced" appear in my original post. That fact doesn't prevent me from being aware of the vulnerabilities of others here who aren't so fortunate.
Perhaps the name of the community needs to be changed to something like "gruesomegothart", if the majority of people in this community feel that this is an appropriate place for that sort of thing to be posted. Is sosadlyfucked multiple herself? We don't know, because she hasn't said. Has she ever posted here before? Don't think so. Why, then, would she come to this community to post such a thing? If multiplicity and abuse-survivorship are in no way related, isn't her post off-topic?
She was posting here at the time I first began livejournal, under another name. (I happen to remember this from links through another multiple community..it is not that I'm so involved I assiduously researched.) So, possibly multiple as well. The conflicts around this image wouldnt be resolved by wether she were singlet or not, I'm afraid.
I really should just delete this entry. It's just not dropping. I thought that the community leader would have deleted it by now, because if it's doing so much harm, then what good would it do to keep arguing and getting upset over it. If it was a mistake, just delete it and drop it.
I happen to love this community. I have posted here on numerous occassions. I have about 10 livejournals (http://www.livejournal.com/users/absinthestalker/friends) because I use one for different aspects of my personality. I don't claim to be multiple, although I have had therapists suspect, investigate and even diagnose me as such. Among other things. But, I find that to be irrelevant. Psychotherapy, in itself, is flawed and I have little faith in it. I've been in therapy since I was 15, institutionalized 4 times and taken everything from old-new anti-depressants to anti-psychotics to anticonvulsants. I have a chronic stomach disorder which has caused me chronic pain my entire life. I gave up on therapy when they told me my only option left was ECT. I don't know if any of this bullshit matters, but since you brought up my credibility, there you go. Honestly, I think it's completely irrelevant and off the subject. In fact, I'm almost disgusted at sharing this because I don't even tell hardly any of my friends about these details.
As for my intention, I already stated it. I wanted to share my art with individuals I thought would appreciate it on some level or another. I have thought about it (being that I've never posted a video before EVER)... I really should have used a different name than sosadlyfucked. I should have used fragileintimacy because the video belonged to her to begin with. I also suspect I shouldn't have put rape statistics with the image.
OR... for this particular community, I probably should have shared something about what the image portrayed to me. Like she said "an artist's statement." I don't claim to be an artist really. I'm just beginning to learn how to create such mediums. I honestly know nothing about art or the culture/norms/expectations that go with it.
I already apologized in the beginning of all this because I realized that I offended someone. Like I said, that was never my intention. I don't care so much about people insulting me because I'm not personally involved with anyone to really feel there is any validity. It does kinda hurt to be compared to a trendy wanna-be shock goth chick. But, I DO acknowledge that my naivety towards the presentation of my art was harmful (for at least one or two people) and I apologize for that again. Don't mistakenly think that I don't respect you. But forgive me for not being good at it.
I don't even post about this anymore because I don't feel my words really even matter. The issue seems beyond me. Like I've given birth to something so evil that apologies or shame means nothing compared to the act itself. I feel my apologies and explanations are worthless now.
I confess my art isn't good by any normal standard. I probably shouldn't be posting my art at all at this point. This entire experience has discouraged me greatly in trusting my own ability to share my art.
"I confess my art isnt good by any normal standard.." Actually, I thought it was pretty effective, and aesthetically had appeal. I have no problem detaching from my more personalised and visceral reaction in order to say that. You certainly havent given birth to anything so evil that apologies or shame are worthless. We saw a powerful image and have been having an intense discussion about powerful images, and the vulnerability of a segment of the multiple population. This too shall pass. I hope you continue with your art, and I apologise, if I have said anything to personally hurt your feelings. There are so many things to learn in the process of our relating to one another, that it is impossible to do everything perfectly.
I didn't actually "bring up your credibility"; certainly did not ask for the personal details of your medical or psychiatric history. The questions I raised were, one, whether you are multiple; two, whether you had ever posted here before; three, if "no" to both, what were you doing coming here posting that image?
So, okay, your answers to the first two questions are somewhat ambiguous - you don't claim to be multiple but some other people have thought you might be, and you have posted here before but under different user-names - but that's good enough for me. I acknowledge that you do have a right to be here, and are not just some "trendy wanna-be shock goth chick" coming in to poke the weirdos. That would have been clearer if you'd posted under a handle you were known by here, and/or had said something about who you are and why you were posting the image, but at least it is clear now.
What pissed me off more than the image itself was your livejournal post about "why is this so offensive?", and especially the prevailing attitude expressed there, that anyone who would find it offensive needs to seek professional help. I think it's safe to say that most of those here who would find it offensive have already sought professional help, and in many cases have found only "professional harm" instead. Comments about belief in the resilience of the human spirit are not to the point either - belief in the resilience of human flesh doesn't give one the right to either cut people up or to discount their protests about having been cut on the grounds that they will probably heal eventually.
I realize that you are not responsible for the remarks or attitudes of people who post to your Lj. However, until now, you had not made any apology in this community about having hurt or upset people (however accidentally), nor was there any apology on your Lj, where the attitude expressed seemed to be "Ha ha, look how shocking I am; I got thrown out of three communities (of losers) just for this." Apologies and explanations are never worthless, but one does have to actually make them in order for them to have worth. Now that you have made some, I accept them, and apologize in turn for mistaking your intentions and hurting your feelings.
As for your art... the purpose of art is to express emotion in such a way that an emotional response is elicited in its audience. It's not necessarily going to be a good, happy, positive response - actually, it would be silly to expect such a response to an image of pain and distress, even from people who have not personally experienced the sort of pain and distress expressed in the image. You got more emotional response here than you bargained for, is all. It doesn't mean your art is evil; it just means (as khailitha explained on your Lj) that you need to consider your choice of venue more carefully.
I am a poet and musician rather than a visual artist, but I too have some work that I would not share because the emotion it would elicit would be unrelieved pain. It doesn't mean it's bad work - it succeeds quite well as art, meaning it does what art is supposed to do very effectively - but it would not be responsible of me to inflict more pain on people who may already have as much as they can bear.
no subject
Date: 2004-03-22 08:33 pm (UTC)Perhaps the name of the community needs to be changed to something like "gruesomegothart", if the majority of people in this community feel that this is an appropriate place for that sort of thing to be posted. Is
no subject
Date: 2004-03-22 09:50 pm (UTC)(I happen to remember this from links through another multiple community..it is not that I'm so involved I assiduously researched.)
So, possibly multiple as well. The conflicts around this image wouldnt be resolved by wether she were singlet or not, I'm afraid.
no subject
Date: 2004-03-22 10:39 pm (UTC)I happen to love this community. I have posted here on numerous occassions. I have about 10 livejournals (http://www.livejournal.com/users/absinthestalker/friends) because I use one for different aspects of my personality. I don't claim to be multiple, although I have had therapists suspect, investigate and even diagnose me as such. Among other things. But, I find that to be irrelevant. Psychotherapy, in itself, is flawed and I have little faith in it. I've been in therapy since I was 15, institutionalized 4 times and taken everything from old-new anti-depressants to anti-psychotics to anticonvulsants. I have a chronic stomach disorder which has caused me chronic pain my entire life. I gave up on therapy when they told me my only option left was ECT. I don't know if any of this bullshit matters, but since you brought up my credibility, there you go. Honestly, I think it's completely irrelevant and off the subject. In fact, I'm almost disgusted at sharing this because I don't even tell hardly any of my friends about these details.
As for my intention, I already stated it. I wanted to share my art with individuals I thought would appreciate it on some level or another. I have thought about it (being that I've never posted a video before EVER)... I really should have used a different name than sosadlyfucked. I should have used fragileintimacy because the video belonged to her to begin with. I also suspect I shouldn't have put rape statistics with the image.
no subject
Date: 2004-03-22 10:39 pm (UTC)I already apologized in the beginning of all this because I realized that I offended someone. Like I said, that was never my intention. I don't care so much about people insulting me because I'm not personally involved with anyone to really feel there is any validity. It does kinda hurt to be compared to a trendy wanna-be shock goth chick. But, I DO acknowledge that my naivety towards the presentation of my art was harmful (for at least one or two people) and I apologize for that again. Don't mistakenly think that I don't respect you. But forgive me for not being good at it.
I don't even post about this anymore because I don't feel my words really even matter. The issue seems beyond me. Like I've given birth to something so evil that apologies or shame means nothing compared to the act itself. I feel my apologies and explanations are worthless now.
I confess my art isn't good by any normal standard. I probably shouldn't be posting my art at all at this point. This entire experience has discouraged me greatly in trusting my own ability to share my art.
no subject
Date: 2004-03-22 11:06 pm (UTC)Actually, I thought it was pretty effective, and aesthetically had appeal. I have no problem detaching from my more personalised and visceral reaction in order to say that.
You certainly havent given birth to anything so evil that apologies or shame are worthless. We saw a powerful image and have been having an intense discussion about powerful images, and the vulnerability of a segment of the multiple population. This too shall pass.
I hope you continue with your art, and I apologise, if I have said anything to personally hurt your feelings. There are so many things to learn in the process of our relating to one another, that it is impossible to do everything perfectly.
no subject
Date: 2004-03-23 11:05 am (UTC)So, okay, your answers to the first two questions are somewhat ambiguous - you don't claim to be multiple but some other people have thought you might be, and you have posted here before but under different user-names - but that's good enough for me. I acknowledge that you do have a right to be here, and are not just some "trendy wanna-be shock goth chick" coming in to poke the weirdos. That would have been clearer if you'd posted under a handle you were known by here, and/or had said something about who you are and why you were posting the image, but at least it is clear now.
What pissed me off more than the image itself was your livejournal post about "why is this so offensive?", and especially the prevailing attitude expressed there, that anyone who would find it offensive needs to seek professional help. I think it's safe to say that most of those here who would find it offensive have already sought professional help, and in many cases have found only "professional harm" instead. Comments about belief in the resilience of the human spirit are not to the point either - belief in the resilience of human flesh doesn't give one the right to either cut people up or to discount their protests about having been cut on the grounds that they will probably heal eventually.
I realize that you are not responsible for the remarks or attitudes of people who post to your Lj. However, until now, you had not made any apology in this community about having hurt or upset people (however accidentally), nor was there any apology on your Lj, where the attitude expressed seemed to be "Ha ha, look how shocking I am; I got thrown out of three communities (of losers) just for this." Apologies and explanations are never worthless, but one does have to actually make them in order for them to have worth. Now that you have made some, I accept them, and apologize in turn for mistaking your intentions and hurting your feelings.
As for your art... the purpose of art is to express emotion in such a way that an emotional response is elicited in its audience. It's not necessarily going to be a good, happy, positive response - actually, it would be silly to expect such a response to an image of pain and distress, even from people who have not personally experienced the sort of pain and distress expressed in the image. You got more emotional response here than you bargained for, is all. It doesn't mean your art is evil; it just means (as
I am a poet and musician rather than a visual artist, but I too have some work that I would not share because the emotion it would elicit would be unrelieved pain. It doesn't mean it's bad work - it succeeds quite well as art, meaning it does what art is supposed to do very effectively - but it would not be responsible of me to inflict more pain on people who may already have as much as they can bear.