multiplicity in fiction: Dune

[chipmunk-planet.livejournal.com]

If you've never read the Dune series by Frank Herbert, go out and read them. Not the prequels, they were written after his death and stink. Start with Dune, written in I believe 1965. It is a classic, arguably the best SF book ever written.

Dune itself is about the dangers of prescience, but what interests me greatly about this series is its attention to the topic of multiplicity. Due to breeding there came to be a class of women who have access to their ancestors' memories, with the help of a substance known as melange (or the spice). This group's goal was to breed a male that could do this, and the first book deals with this quite a bit. But something went wrong and Paul could see the future as well (It wasn't clear about whether he had access to his ancestors' memories too, but it suggests at the end of the third book that he did). His children and sister, though, clearly had access to all their ancestors' memories, and the next two books, Dune Messiah and Children of Dune, go into this a lot. Of the two, Children of Dune is written the best.

I just finished re-reading Children of Dune last night, and as with every time I read this, I'm struck with how the author portrays the experience of being a community. The only thing he doesn't have with his characters is losing time (which is what disabled me -- I had a job where I just couldn't lose time and work). One of the issues these people face is that an evil ancestor in each case tries to take over the collective, something called Abomination. One character loses the battle and becomes possessed, the other two make bargains with the group inside and remain mostly themselves. I found that concept frightening in abstract, but not too applicable (after all, our people are just us, not some weird ancestor from the past ... imagine if you descended from Ghengis Khan or something!) For me, the task is to understand these parts of myself and become a more well-rounded person, something that was taken from me as a child.

In any case, it's not too often that the experience of life as a community is portrayed in such a positive manner. It's strange that I've never seen anyone comment on this, as it plays such a huge role in the series.

Comments

[hellmutt.livejournal.com]

Ooh, excellent discussion topic.

I've only read the first book, so will have one eye covered in case of spoilers, but it'll be great to hear what our various multiple members think.

[catskillmarina.livejournal.com]

Thanks for reminding us of the dune books. We are working on
collecting material about multiplicity and mythology.

--- Constance

[sethrenn.livejournal.com]

Some people do experience walk-ins who they say are ancestors, past lives, etc. I'm not saying that they always necessarily are these things, but the person subjectively experiences them that way.

It sounds interesting, although I wish they hadn't done the whole good/evil dichotomy with it. What I'd really like to see sometime is a story where the walk-in actually turns out to be really nice, helpful, etc.

[hellmutt.livejournal.com]

But "good" is part of the good/evil dichotomy. :)

How about one where it's neutral? *loves moral ambiguity like it's chocolate*

[nat-leia.livejournal.com]

Well... I live with quite a bunch of Dune-worlders [rather not going into details how we got together, it would get complicated, more than just classical soulbond stuff] and we debated about this good/evil dichotomy quite a lot [... I am rereading Dune series from time to time every year, just to see what they might mean when specifically referencing something which I don't have deep knowledge of].

The point which we agreed in with those debates is that it was just a label to make it more understandable to other people... the knowledge of the functioning of Other Memories would be comparable to concepts of mental illnesses risks, ptsd etc. in some pieces, and thus labeled "evil"... Different terms for the same thing, not to be taken in religious connotations necessary, nor the morality implying.

Nat- first half of the message
Leto- the second one

[mirrorbrothers.livejournal.com]

Frankly I think a lot of that "Abomination" stuff was just a portrayal of prejudice. Alia, for example, wasn't even close to as bad as Jessica thought.

- Johnny

[chipmunk-planet.livejournal.com]

True. She died of her own fear, really. Perhaps they could have gotten control of the Baron somehow, if the BG had come to help her rather than run from her.

[nat-leia.livejournal.com]

We do think that too.

Leto/Nat

[ksol1460.livejournal.com]

I get Dune out and read it every couple years. More than anything else the Bene Gesserit and their genetic memory put me in mind of Zenna Henderson and the idea of assembling, which is the act of accessing a dead relative's memories and relating them as a story. What Alia went through in the sequel does bear some resemblence to what Southeast Asian people believe about possession by ancestral spirits.

I'm aware of Herbert's enlightened viewpoints (he was the founder of Earth Day) and willingness to explore practically anything including the use of psychedelics and their possible consciousness expanding properties. I also admire his anti-psychiatry view and belief that people should think for themselves. He portrayed the abilities of the Bene Gesserit as something that anyone could learn given the proper training and I appreciated that having read too much SF (like Henderson's) where it was all a Gift and unaccessible to we morons.

I wouldn't put down ol' Temujin too much. You know, he is very much loved by his own people, and is thought of kind of like a George Washington. Or maybe something sort of like Alexander the Great. Now if I had George W. Bush for a relative I'd worry.

[chipmunk-planet.livejournal.com]

Well I was going to write "Hitler" then remembered he had no children. As far as I know, anyway.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

However, anyone can be reincarnated.....

and as for Dune as Multiplicity, that comparison struck me as well. I in particular love Children of Dune, especially where Harkonnen possesses Alia.

Hitler-Friendly reminder
Baron Harkonnen-posting about his fictional counterpart.

[nat-leia.livejournal.com]

Also enjoyed that part, for it was interestingly written with a hint of drama. It seemed to us Mr. Herbert tries to avoid drama if possible, so this "weakness" was fun to read.

Ghani and Leto

[sharpsight.livejournal.com]

N) Note: it wasn't an ancestor called Abomination, it was that certain children (depending on genetics, if I understood correctly), if exposed to high enoughl levels of spice in the womb, could become Abomination: a state of being, rather than a specific person.