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Interesting ruminations by our philosopher-selves.

The following is rumination by our Lucifer Davison:
The idea that there could be people born multiple instantly means that for a small minority, the system (no pun intended) is wrong. They are not matching the identity of the common person on the street. They are instead:
A subculture of bodies with multiple inhabitants. The ramifications of this are big, especially where religion is concerned. If people are born with more than one soul, then to them the Biblical proscription of "One soul, one mind, one body" is not accurate. If so, this means that there is a full-fledged option to be different from the common culture. Multiplicity, if divorced from the doctrine of mental disorder would potentially be far more upsetting than Homosexuality. If people can have experiences of living in a body and can be proud of that fact, then there is a consequence for society. The consequence is that simplicity, that panacea of Fundamentalism and Social conservatism, is thrown out with the bath-water. The same is true for the natural multiples that weren't caused by trauma. Psychiatry does not recognize them and tries to suppress them with all the power of the State. Multiplicity, specifically the natural and born versions, is a potential death-blow to the infantilizing notions of mental health and extremist religion. Multiples have the ability to grasp far more of human potential, if only they choose to reach for it. They can reach for their potential in ways denied Singletons. The Singleton seeks relief in religion, in alcohol, in fruitless activities that are harmful to him or her and cannot escape the grim realities of this world. People in systems can, and that is what causes members of systems to be regarded as coping mechanisms and arrested development. We who are united in the simple fact that we are people who reside not in houses of steel or brick but of flesh. If people can be born multiple, then the world is far more complex than the average Fundamentalist of any religion or creed can stomach. That is my view on why the Establishment fights to keep the knowledge of healthy, normal multiplicity from being known. Thanks for playing!
Comments, anyone?

[identity profile] bladespark.livejournal.com 2007-03-01 11:17 pm (UTC)(link)
Biblical proscription of "One soul, one mind, one body?" Never heard of this, and I'm pretty well versed in the Bible. Can you give me chapter and verse on that? A search for "one soul" turns up only these:

"And levy a tribute unto the LORD of the men of war which went out to battle: one soul of five hundred, both of the persons, and of the beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep:" (Numbers 31:28)

"And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common." (Acts 4:32) Which is referring to a whole group being "one soul."

A search for "one mind" turns up lots of stuff, but it's all of the same sort, talking about groups of individuals who were metaphorically of one mind. And "one body" turns up the various metaphors about the body of Christ being the church of Christ.

Where does it say the one soul, one mind, one body thing?

[identity profile] eridanusus.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:06 am (UTC)(link)
Yes, well, according to the Bible, homosexuality and eating shellfish are the same level of upsetting.

[identity profile] tej-agni.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:09 am (UTC)(link)
I thought there were three within one for Christianity. A father, a son, and a holy spirit all in one god being or a holy trinity.

Amalah

[identity profile] cirape.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:11 am (UTC)(link)
You really believe that the establishment (the man?) is trying to keep multiples down and/or hidden? Do you have proof of this?

[identity profile] aimeepatricia.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:15 am (UTC)(link)
Hi. This entire diatribe makes my head hurt, and I don't understand it. Could the nice man(?) explain what he was talking about, or what he was trying to point out?

[identity profile] eridanusus.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:16 am (UTC)(link)
Just the other day I had the SIS turn up and go through my IM history to make sure I wasn't spreading lies about MPD to the populace.

[identity profile] aimeepatricia.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:16 am (UTC)(link)
I would of thought they had more the keep track of. UFOs, Democrats, Anti-War people, Bob Dole's Cyborg, the Ghost of Disney....

[identity profile] cirape.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:22 am (UTC)(link)
No, no, its not the ghost of disney, its the cyrogenically frozen head, possibly now attached to a robot ;P

(I did was a serious reply from the original poster, btw. Just defending myself in case it comes up, since I seem to be afraid I'll be accused of starting trouble.)

[identity profile] nat-leia.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:24 am (UTC)(link)
I'm just wondering where did the author(s) get there are some ways of reaching the potential specific to multiples, and how exactly are people living in plural conditions *not* seeking relief in religion, in alcohol and fruitless activities...

Depends, maybe I've misread something.

[identity profile] shandra.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:26 am (UTC)(link)
Not in the bible that I'm aware of (which means nothing as I might well just not know) but the Catholic catechism definitely does say this - we had someone in our system going through the RCIA process who talked a Jesuit about it (and didn't convert, for that reason among many).

[identity profile] aimeepatricia.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:29 am (UTC)(link)
The shellfish thing is true, too. They were pretty harsh back then, they had to be.

[identity profile] cirape.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:33 am (UTC)(link)
Oh, yes, I know. I've never read the bible, but I've had people point out to me some of the 'absurd' (by today's standards, don't know the standards of that time) things they condemned.

[identity profile] bladespark.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 12:52 am (UTC)(link)
Interesting. Is "one soul, one mind, one body" the actual wording used?

[identity profile] ksol1460.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:15 am (UTC)(link)
Some of the younger fronters agree with part of what you're saying, except for the "able to grasp far more of human potential" part.

We see no reason why singlets shouldn't grasp just as much of human potential (provided one's into that sort of thing, which we're not) as multiples. There's been tons written by singlets about other worlds and realities.

What we think concerns the dominant culture about us, if anything, is the idea of multiple persons in one body symbolizing lack of their control over the population. The existence of multiples implies that the government and dominant culture don't control as much as they think they do, and that scares them.

It's the same with pathologizing religious experience ("She talks to God? Okay, lock her up and give her these pills") or other normal life problems and experiences, control is paramount, or the economy would be affected! Can't have that!

[identity profile] ksol1460.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:18 am (UTC)(link)
Man is a creature which has a body and a soul. One each.

[identity profile] eridanusus.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:27 am (UTC)(link)
...I don't think the government honestly cares.

[identity profile] bladespark.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:48 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, seconded. I've NEVER once heard of the government going after a multiple, in any context.

[identity profile] tej-agni.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:51 am (UTC)(link)
I've learned that the U.S. government loves to have control.

Amalah

[identity profile] tej-agni.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:54 am (UTC)(link)
If everyone in a group has their own bodies then there are many souls capable of sharing the earth body. :)

-Butterfly

[identity profile] rabbitsystem.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 01:57 am (UTC)(link)
Hah! The next time I am in church I shall be sure to remember that I cannot believe, because that is merely a failing of weak-minded singletons. One soul, one body? Perhaps, but such is never specified. Several souls? One soul with several consciousnesses forming a single being on a level we cannot currently understand? Possibly, even probably.
I rather like the idea of having superhuman potential, though. Could you teach me how to access it, or must I wait for the happy fairies to come and show me?
-Durza

[identity profile] bladespark.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 02:04 am (UTC)(link)
Yes, but only over things they view as powerful. The government isn't even aware of multiplicity as anything but a weird little footnote of psychiatry. They don't view us as powerful, we're not a voting bloc, we don't hold office or have lots of money or anything else. We're not an advocacy group, we're not organized as a group at all! And we're so far into the closet, most of us, that they don't even know we're here.

What is there for them to control, and why should they bother?

[identity profile] ksol1460.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 02:18 am (UTC)(link)
*grins* If only they could be counted as earthworld bodies! Well, I might bring that up with Father at the orphanage sometime, but he's one of the real ones... says God's mysteries are infinite.

[identity profile] ksol1460.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 02:37 am (UTC)(link)
You're right, all of you; I should have left the word "government" out of it. "Dominant culture," though, is a lot more than just the government.

[identity profile] catskillmarina.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 02:48 am (UTC)(link)
The government did have a psy-ops program that tried to make multiples into assassins.
The program was documented in the Church hearings on the MK-Ultra program in the 60's
and 70's. I met a lady who was a programmer at UCLA in that period. Totally gone. Wore
plastic to try to protect herself from it, but when i questioned her about the programming
she did she talked cogently about early LISP which was used in DARPA a lot because it was
considered an artificial intelligence language. It was her knowlege of the computer stuff
that convinced me personally that she was telling the truth.

--- Miri of Mtribe

PS - i wonder sometimes what happened to her. We tried to help her but she seemed beyond
help.

[identity profile] bladespark.livejournal.com 2007-03-02 02:50 am (UTC)(link)
Still don't see it. Give me examples here, because I'm not seeing what you're seeing, apparently.

What I see is the dominant culture having no idea that we exist at all. And the few that notice us notice the extreme versions, the Sybils and the other media-hyped cases. But they still don't really know anything, and they still don't really CARE.

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