symptoms anyone?

[idianshire.livejournal.com]

I have been wondering since a previous post what the symptoms of multiplicity (not the disordered view) actually are. I mean I know what you read on other websites, but they seem more to do with post traumatic stress than multiplicity, or someone that thinks Sybil is the only multiple known in the last 50 years. Now I don’t mean what makes someone multiple, we are fine with our definition of that, the debate here is what would be on a checklist. I hate the word symptom because it does imply illness, maybe characteristics would be a better word. Things like time loss.. which I know a lot of multiples don’t actually have, I suppose we do lose time, although as Tryall said it isn’t so much that we lose time as much as someone’s life/activities/ are so boring no one else pays any attention. We lose time by a conscious choice. We hear voices but in a study we took part in the woman running it said that hearing voices is something a large part of the population does anyway. Maybe there aren’t any clear cut symptoms/characteristics that are relevant to multiples/plurals as a group, and maybe we are all just so bored that the most exciting thing for us to do is argue amongst ourselves on this foggy day… which is more likely

Comments

[viatar.livejournal.com]

i'd say that it's as simple as this: there's someone else who isn't you with whom you share a physical body. That is broad enough that it would encompass both the disordered and healthy multiples. Of course, in some disordered systems, not everyone is AWARE that they are sharing the body with someone else, but imo, the presence of more than one distinct person sharing a physical body would seem to be the defining characteristic of multiplicity.

Re-reading your post, it looks like the question you are asking is more geared toward how you figure out for sure that there really is someone else in there when you have limited communication and/or only suspect someone else present?

[elenbarathi.livejournal.com]

Heh, well, there's "owning far too many books", which is probably the major 'symptom' around here: Kír's the serious scholar, and I collect fantasy and SF, so our combined library is rather vast.

There's "changing clothes a lot" - Crist-Erui takes off anything he finds uncomfortable; a lot of the stuff he does find comfortable would not survive his wearing it outdoors; Kír objects to feminine clothing. So... we may go through several different outfits in a single day. We've all got our own favorite boots, coats, etc.

What else? Well, I never knew I did this, until jhonathand came to live here and pointed it out: apparently fairly often when I'm talking I'll pause, then totally revise what I was saying. This isn't because we've "switched", though - it's still me; just that Kír's listening to the conversation too, and sometimes - okay, often - makes remarks about what I'm saying. He objects to me being vulgar, bitchy, or "overly forthcoming", and a lot of times I don't realize that I am being so till he mentions it, so then have to back-track.

My kid says she can always tell when Crist-Erui 'flickers in' when I'm performing (I'm a Ren Faire musician) because he gets "that deer-in-the-headlights look" for just an instant. His guitar-technique is more fluid and powerful than mine, so when he 'flickers out' again, a lot of times I'll fumble a little before I catch my flow again. I don't think anyone but another guitarist would notice this, though, and certainly nobody would guess the cause if they didn't already know.

People who do know don't seem to have much trouble telling us apart. Our posture and movement is different enough that we can't "pass" as one another even if we don't talk - this is kind of a problem for Kír at present; he'd like to go do archery with one of my friends who doesn't know him, but doesn't want to reveal himself as a different person. (Kír is generally opposed to revealing himself as a different person; he says that people who don't know or can't tell don't need to know.)

Both my daughter and our housemate jhonathand say that our scent changes when we 'switch' - that we bring forth different notes of whatever fragrance we're wearing. This would probably only be noticeable to someone who spent a lot of time in close proximity to all three of us, so as to have a basis for comparison.

LOL, if the glasses are off outdoors, that'd be Crist-Erui, because Kír and I can't manage without them. If we're striding happily out the door - without the glasses - an hour before dawn in the midst of a howling January gale, that would be Crist-Erui. He is very shy, though, and Kír is very paranoid about strangers learning of his existence, so unless you're on the 'short list', your chances of seeing him for more than a moment or two are negligible.

We've spent our whole lives learning not to "show symptoms of multiplicity", and I think we're pretty damn good at it. People who know can tell us apart, but I don't think there's any way that someone who didn't know could tell for sure. My daughter says she figured it out when she was 6, because she followed Crist-Erui into the forest and watched him, but I don't think she really *knew*, and she didn't ask directly till she was 14.

LOL, jhonathand and I got all kinds of hilarious, sitting out on the porch while I tried to imitate Kír's voice and manner of speaking. I thought I did it pretty well the last try, but both he and Kír say no, not convincing. Ohh well - *grins* - I'm a bard, not an actress.

[tir-nan-og.livejournal.com]

We do have stuffed toys- we have some nice teddy bears, and it ain't no damned symptom! It's who we are! It's amazing how just about anything can get pathologized by some people..

[ksol1460.livejournal.com]

Maybe "sign" instead of "symptom"?

We have had emails from people every now and then who are essentially asking us to diagnose them. They tend to describe one or two of the "classic", Sybil-like events like blackouts, or say that they get angry now and then and don't know why. Many of them just describe their abuse histories in very graphic terms.

Sometimes they don't leave their email addresses -- I don't know how they expect us to get in touch -- but when they do, we reply and ask them if they've ever sensed presences, or had any evidence that there were other people around. Most of the time, they don't write back.

The only sign of multiplicity we know of is presences. We don't know of any other way to tell, because all the other things on the checklists could have other natural causes, either psychological or physical.

[changelyng14.livejournal.com]

I don't know so much about multiplicity symptoms in general, but I've caught on to a number of 'common tendencies' among face personalities. which is probabaly what one would be dealing with if an inquiring individual was in front of you.

i get these somewhat from research, followed by trying them out on some of the systems i know irl in my area.

-faces are the last to know of their system, and are designed (may i use that word without offending? i happen to be a face so...) to pass for normal.

-faces are generally good at getting along with people, and may generally be capable of fitting into any crowd.

-face's big mission in life may be to be 'normal' and 'like everyone else' as opposed to say, being 'successful' or 'standing above'

-some faces accomplish certain tasks by preparing everything needed to do something, and then 'viola' its done. (i do this with programming) or, possibly you set out to do a task, and you cant do it right away, but if you focus on it long enough, you suddenly become capable/good at it. (apparently it never occurs to faces that this is out of the ordinary)

-its a faces job to not know about their system, and to be sure noone else does.

****

heres some other factors that make me wonder if im dealing with a closet split.

-too many nicknames.
-actual names for themselves when their in modes, ie. angry
-radical shifts in lifestyle/career/whatever (super-femme gothboy who says he used to play college sports, for example)
-looking up, and to the left when being asked questions about past events (dont ask)

dunno if any of these have anything to do with reality, but im experimenting with them for now.

Lovecry

[sethrenn.livejournal.com]

Hmm... the only good one I've ever been able to think of is 'experiencing the presence of other people in your mind/body.' And depending on what one's beliefs on things like possession are, that's not necessarily a universal constant either. Hm.

As far as people wanting to come up with ways to 'spot' multiples, my usual response is 'good luck'-- a smoothly running system which is actively coordinating to remain in the closet (as we have for fairly long periods) can pretty much remain undetected. The problem with trying to identify multiples using some of the more textbook checklists is that you can't tell if you're dealing with a genuinely unaware system, or a deliberate faker who's read up on all the things they're 'supposed' to show.

(What's interesting is that in the few cases where we started wondering if a friend was plural and they actually turned out to be, it was because they had a "muse" or "roleplaying character" who seemed to be rather too much of an independent separate person. Hm.)

[shandra.livejournal.com]

I think one of the stronger outside signs with us is how different we each are in terms of tastes (as well as body language and demeanour). If someone goes out to dinner with me they'll get "yum! ice cream!" and with Lyria she doesn't eat it.

That goes from the fairly shallow (ice cream) to the fairly deep (sexual orientation) and has been something that people have commented on even when completely oblivious to other things. I think it comes out because people can ignore a lot of things under the "one person" assumption, but if it's commonly shared-with-friends interests, then switching around really impacts on the friendship or relationship.

(This is one reason we don't like the phone, I think. In the past being around a friend was a pull to the front for the "right" person, but on the phone it wasn't so clear, and so we would get situations like my friend saying "Oh! I got tickets to see Rush!" and the person on the phone would be less than enthusiastic, and then we'd have a little muddle. Sigh.)

It is hard to say "diverse interests" is a symptom of anything, because it's such a fuzzy thing (and one can hear the cries of 'fake' from far away), but then so is losing time vs. forgetfulness.

We also display different talents and that kind of thing. As our old music coach said at one time "in competition 9 times out of 10 you play at the top of your ability, but the 10th time it seems like you can barely play at all." (That tenth time would have been me!!) Again, not really a definitive thing, but it's something I have seen in other multiples.

But - we have had the relatively spectacular time loss incidents in the past, so that was even clearer.